In this conversation, John O'Hara, inventor of the Advanced Message Queuing Protocol (AMQP), discusses this standard's history and development with Kate Holterhoff, senior analyst at RedMonk. O'Hara shares insights about the complexities of middleware, the importance of standards, and the evolution of AMQP 0-9-1 and 1-0. He reflects on the AMQP working group, the role of hyperscalers in shaping standards, the limitations of HTTP, and the importance of standards bodies like ISO, OASIS, and IEC. O'Hara emphasizes the need for middleware to become as ubiquitous as the web and shares insights on the future of AMQP and the standards process.